Gbts VAZ, what are they and what are the possibilities?
Hi all, this post was born because of the large number of questions on the products of AVTOVAZ.Here I will try to explain what were the projects and what changes were made in one or another cylinder head to achieve the set objectives.Wanted to share a classic cylinder head and cylinder head front-VAZ, but it would be very stretched, this pose all in one text.
And so gbts VAZ are 8кл and 16кл in turn 8кл are divided into classic and front-wheel drive.
From the point of view of obtaining power konechno 16кл is in competition with it and begin.
Stock sizes of channels and valves will not describe (I think known to all) in the case of:
1.size valves intake and configuration of the channel flow is enough to produce 110-120 forces(purging below), the size of the channel even too big in my opinion.
2.the sizes of valves of the issue is enough to produce 170-180 forces.
A modified cylinder head with 32mm install valves on the inlet and 29mm valves on the issue is enough to produce 220-240V forces question at what rpm it happens and what is the volume of the motor is covered with this cylinder head, respectively, than the amount more the at lower rpm, this power is reached and Vice versa less than the amount of the at higher rpm, everything happens, everything else will depend on the correctness of the selected components of the intake and exhaust, friction, CR - compression ratio(used gasoline) and piston configuration.Cam shafts are included in the components of intake and exhaust of course.
Example nekotoroe time ago I did a project a vase 16кл 84mm piston 80mm stroke cylinder head with valves 32-29mm shafts from OKB engine(can't remember which phase of 1.25 mm 250g)petrol 98,piston je-pistons rings is 4 throttle originally from gingerbread-80,then r-1 I think Yamaha.
package contents:
1.valve intake and exhaust ferrea
2.the valve springs ferrea dual
3.napravlyayutsya BMW(colored)
4.channels portirovaniyu respectively specification
5.bed shaft pravlinnya
6.malogorski on the Cams shafts
7.hard pusher(full Board)
The result was 217лс and 205нм moment capacity of 8300 currently about 6000.From the point of view of current knowledge I can say that the potential is not fully disclosed, but the result is not bad(I drove it which is impressive), I can say that the transition on the throttle from Yamaha's allowed to increase torque with the 3500 if I'm not mistaken on 20nm, I think about 16кл enough
So 8кл front-wheel drive:
The drain valves and portaromana channel was assembled motor 1.6 liter 82.5 mm piston is 75.6 mm stroke, exhaust 4-2-1 made themselves the main pipe 60mm resonator+muffler straight-through.Camshaft OKB engine 54 if I'm not mistaken, CR 10:1,gasoline 95.In fact 125лс and 152нм of torque at 3600,power at 5800-6000 do not remember(graphics destroyed by a water leak, very sorry)
package contents:
1.inlet valve release flow
2.spring runoff
3.manifold intake drain
4.replaced the saddle
5.combustion chamber modification
6.the control unit Corvette
Now 8кл classic
Previous story the engine was done according to the technical requirements of class "a legend" prohibited all!
in addition to piston and rings, dia 79mm, 80mm stroke, free exhaust after the stock exhaust manifold.With I'll say right away that the cylinder head classics the most difficult head of all Vazov and not only in form and arrangement of the channels and how they work(blown).Even more funny thing is the intake manifold(carburetor)legends ride carbeco, although fuel injected is not much better(requires attention and attached arms), right to the figures:
got 95лс and 142 nm of torque, curve of books only all of the above, what is most interesting corners of the plug on the book one to one/.the initial 3-5g before TDC on maximinoi power 32-36гр.The time in 3200-3500 power 5600rpm.Camshaft shaft Niva 1.7 8.5 degree gasoline 95,92 although the same result.
Package all standard with the exception of the piston and piston rings, piston Egorova V. A. hats off and many thanks to him, rings Opel or Daewoo.
Well, for the first time enough, and then I loaded You, sorry the photo is not much.All the wide shelf time
16кл Stoke
16кл valve 32mm
8кл front-wheel drive Stoke
8кл periodperiod ports
classic Stoke
classics made channel drain
h2o28
judge for yourself Subaru of 2.0 on 04 swells to 3,000,when it is 1.6 sec at 4000 and 6200 shafts ends that's the whole story, can be screwed and 42 Jetix whether it is a question
Not quite in the topic question. On a standard motor the 1.7 Niva plan to install boost. Some of the turbines, garret gt17, k03 kkk or ihi vf13, you should use that boost came as early as possible and that the motor spun a thousand to 5500...6000? Of course some garret gt12 will come on boost from idle, but plugging on the issue happens to thousands of four.
h2o28
so under these projects are very different cylinder head needs
Well, the concept that probably the same...
h2o28
judge for yourself Subaru of 2.0 on 04 swells to 3,000,when it is 1.6 sec at 4000 and 6200 shafts ends that's the whole story, can be screwed and 42 Jetix whether it is a question
The shafts are in the plans to change to a more phase, where the 270-280, well, rise, respectively, to turns 7000-7500
here 90% of the flood, you've seen a lot of articles here with graphs of the measurements, purge the cylinder head etc?
Honestly I will not say, those who travel on 05 tell that to 4000 blows already bar. But again the same with their words, checking is not possible. 04 should swell with a gun before.
The sub blows 04 3,000 up to what boost?
judge for yourself Subaru of 2.0 on 04 swells to 3,000,when it is 1.6 sec at 4000 and 6200 shafts ends that's the whole story, can be screwed and 42 Jetix whether it is a question
Anarchious
Motor everyday + of pokatuha. Shafts are planned, but not now.
What he bases this prediction?
turbine big for the 1.6 sports is still suitable for the city I would be less looking for
Motor everyday + of pokatuha. Shafts are planned, but not now.
What he bases this prediction?
Anarchious
High block, the connecting rods 10, the pistons 124+puddle snail ТД04, shafts stock (yet), benzo 95 only, the planned boost to 1.5, pranita a capacity of 250...
more than 180-190 forces around 5800-6200 navryatli happen if you configure a secure rest shafts
h2o28
volume what TD04 with more than 1-1. 2 pressure to raise useless, if only the intercooler, not water
Well, I'm probably more than 1.2 podnijeti and I will not. The data that resulted as a maximum...
volume what TD04 with more than 1-1. 2 pressure to raise useless, if only the intercooler, not water
High block, the connecting rods 10, the pistons 124+puddle snail ТД04, shafts stock (yet), benzo 95 only, the planned boost to 1.5, pranita a capacity of 250...
not specific question, what is the geometry of the motor(bottom), turbine shafts, used gasoline, which motor drag, ring, urban race, how much power you want to get?
Then a more specific question — what would you recommend specifically for the head?
Then let's say In the plans Turboproekt on the 16V, the bottom is going Alo interested in the head
it is necessary not to straighten the channel and give it a form which would be more correct for this (particular cylinder head), it all depends on the desired power and engine rpm
As I understand it to do the ports and there are all sorts of distortions with the 16V head does not makes sense. Enough to straighten the channels and modify the chamfers. Or I something not so understood?
Thank you very much for the information! Still would like to know precisely what was the cylinder head ports 8кл front-wheel drive.
Serious modernizirovana cylinder head made! This is to make a smoother channel, so that increased the CFM, as I understand it?
What is this control unit is a Corvette, You think somewhere else mentioned? He put on any car?
ExReA
Graphic view of the engine aspirated 1.6, but 1.8 250 strength? Without reference acid, and other additives, ceiling 1600 CC engine VAZ on the dampers was achieved on the 9300 (if memory serves) rpm and 225 equal forces. This motor preparation, perhaps one of the most powerful racing teams.
And what kind of motor and what year it was?
Graphic view of the engine aspirated 1.6, but 1.8 250 strength? Without reference acid, and other additives, ceiling 1600 CC engine VAZ on the dampers was achieved on the 9300 (if memory serves) rpm and 225 equal forces. This motor preparation, perhaps one of the most powerful racing teams.
ExReA
What is the volume in question? During the preparation of the motors in supertourisme, the threshold 220 of the forces on 1600 kubova the motor is not broke. You can see the graphics bench test these motors. Especially in 250 HP
PEQ is 1.8, or 1.6 gruelsome 224
Question adresovan was a citizen above about 250 power cylinder head Torgmash, granting some huge raise...
The volume 1,77,2,0 it was about the possibility of obtaining this capacity until 217 is a maximum of a 98 gasoline from us.
on 16V pig is at the correct revision from 204 to 250лс you can get, but if the cylinder head rework of Tormas there are other figures
What is the volume in question? During the preparation of the motors in supertourisme, the threshold 220 of the forces on 1600 kubova the motor is not broke. You can see the graphics bench test these motors. Especially in 250 HP
on 16V pig is at the correct revision from 204 to 250лс you can get, but if the cylinder head rework of Tormas there are other figures
h2o28
It is in General bad, is made very poorly and is structurally correct
Well, that's what year it came up the same, and upgrades — 0
to change the shape of the channels and the combustion chamber and the location of the valves and their size
But some rework in your opinion it is possible if it is not a commercial secret of course) Interested in more for the sake of interest, when cooked Lada, and in motorsports have participated and studied the Soviet Motorsport. Now they have a place only in special classes, something like a race of old time, and so on.
About ferrea question to the Lada does not apply) bold hurts. Although at the time we picked up the valve from Subaru seems some, with a leg of 5.5-6mm. But I will not lie, I do not remember.
And what is in your opinion bad pozitsionirovanie, because of the offset relative to the channels? And in the combustion chamber what are the weaknesses in your opinion?
on the classics or who carry will not be tuning 8кл head is not popular, especially classical.It poor positioning of the seat relative to the channel, it often happens that 2-3 channels work well, and one actually not pout, even though they appear to all channels equally
Yes, both questions about the classics. For the rest pretty decent experience) of Firrea so no one started to carry, sadly) America just sometimes quite a long wait turns, but the choice is huge.
If possible, a couple of questions:
1) where at the moment in Russia to buy products of ferrea in addition to Atomik-shop?
2) a few words about Zhiguli cylinder head, as with a standard cylinder head(ie not spective in the likeness of VFTS), you can get the results and under what parameters the saddle channel.
3) what is the complexity and peculiarity of the purge cylinder head of classics, a few words. If you don't mind.
Hello, not quite understand the tables, the speed of which is listed and the units of measurement?
Not really small for the channel, and especially near the saddle (valve) or in some other place? Even if you do not measure and mathematically calculate: Velosity = Air Flow/Area where Air Flow=(144/60)*CFM is not clear, measurement or calculation speed. 230 CFM on the 32 mm valve is most likely the CSA within 1.756 (In^2) subject to 0.236 in (valve stem diametr). Therefore the speed will be 318 ft/sec, which is not even bad
what is this, the estimated flow rate to the calibration drive (orifline) blow-off booth (flowbench)?
Is the velocity in the measuring element flowbench and not in the channel and especially at the saddle
Now everything is clear, I have a slightly different principle, stand three very sensitive pressure sensor. A pilot tube I only use for local measurements of velocity and searching for problem areas.
Thanks for the clarification
It is not measured and calculated, knowing the speed and section calculation of volume
h2o28
8 valves are going well only in the middle, at high speeds of filling to find a very difficult job
that's why many athletes did not put shirokolashki on your 8 klapannym.
and in the book of des hemila described
akv0
count from 11 to 12. Channels on 2m sharpen more. Valve standard t-shaped. I thought the shaft to the shaft of the takeoff phase and 10.75 290.
this shaft is closer in the parameters, but the rise is small
the worse the channel, the flatter the valve it will require for best results, purge, in 16кл cylinder head vase is not working
h2o28
t-shaped valve fiction, size of channels need to be considered
Soooo! Your T valve is not working?
count from 11 to 12. Channels on 2m sharpen more. Valve standard t-shaped. I thought the shaft to the shaft of the takeoff phase and 10.75 290.
h2o28
What is the geometry of the motor, stroke, connecting rod length, degree.Valve drain or more in size
jet valves drain
What is the geometry of the motor, stroke, connecting rod length, degree.Valve drain or more in size
with 2 to 7,000 thousand will go on the shafts and on the volume of 1.8.
Shafts gave me such
Camshaft 2108 — 2110 Nuzhdin of 10.63 (phase 277). Recommended installation phase — the inlet is open at 32 degrees before TDC, and close 65 degrees after BDC, the release opening 65 degrees before BDC, closing at 32 degrees after TDC. The lift of the intake valve at the point of VMT 1.25 mm.
8 valves are going well only in the middle, at high speeds of filling to find a very difficult job
h2o28
Generally there are no such plans.The choice of shafts is based on specific objectives that put in front of the motor. What are the goals You presleduet I don't know the degree of refinement of the Cylinder head also did not see, can be formulate the question more precisely?
As you said the bandwidth of the modified cylinder vases with valves 32 29 sufficient to produce 220-240 forces, and Ino the cylinder head 16 KL under the same diameter of the cylinder with the same size valves, such as a d16 Honda, Volkswagen 9a, Lanos etc. much superior to the gbts VAZ 16 CR max for purging?
Yes, I've re-read the question — he smiled ))
Motor for pulsedrive first. Amateur ride and traffic light racing is secondary.
Drivetrain is already lock, the 12th series with a pair of 4.1, the lightweight flywheel.
Generally there are no such plans.The choice of shafts is based on specific objectives that put in front of the motor. What are the goals You presleduet I don't know the degree of refinement of the Cylinder head also did not see, can be formulate the question more precisely?
Welcome, Dmitry!
Tell me, do You plan in the future to describe tips 16 valve vases?
I plan to put a motor with priors, it would be interesting to hear more about the choice of the receiver and shafts
the rise of the purge valve 8кл cylinder head front-wheel drive is specified in inches?
the rise of the purge valve 8кл cylinder head classic motor specified in cm?
vasek199
for engine analyzer
data to lay the purge of my head and not someone else, believe me the results will be very different